Post by Deleted on May 3, 2021 5:03:10 GMT
Just a few thoughts here about shunning those who leave the PR denomination, which is many of us here. I am approaching this from the way I interpret the issue and the verses I mention, and from a view that many PRs may share to some degree and use as points in their arguments.
The Bible does, in fact, mention shunning as an appropriate action towards those guilty of certain sins, such as greed, sexual immorality, idolatry, and a few others (I Cor. 5:11). Every human who has ever lived (even those in the PRC) has been guilty of at least one of these sins at one time or another.
Do we know for sure all the sins others in our lives have been / are guilty of? Not always; most of the time, no.
Does the fact that we committed these sins mean we are destined for eternal hellfire? Yes, but Jesus died for the sins of a select few.
Do we know exactly who is part of this select few? No; and even if we are supposed to see this "by their fruits", this is still not enough evidence for us imperfect humans to make a judgment on another's eternal destination, since we never know all the fruits a person bears in their life. A person is judged by God on the complete life they've lived; did the Holy Spirit cause them to repent? We can never know for sure, since we are not all-knowing. None of us know absolutely everything about even our own lives, much less the lives of others. Only God does, so only he can judge.
The only people who are deserving of shunning are those who have committed the unforgiveable sin, part of which is unrepentance. People may live in certain vile sins without remorse for many years, but we may never know if they will eventually turn from these sins, so we should treat them with grace, as Jesus, who was always ministering to those considered to be the vile ones of society, did, while also protecting our own spiritual well-being and that of those for whom we are responsible, such as our children. I emphasize that this does not mean cutting off someone absolutely. There must always be room for grace; to deny this is to deny the power of the Holy Spirit, and part of the unforgiveable sin. To treat them as dead when they may be very much alive, so to speak, is a serious mistake, and is in disobedience to the greatest commandment of all, which is to love others. Some of us may know what I Cor. 13 says, which is that without this love for others, we are nothing, regardless of what else we do or what others may think of us.
I guess to summarize, the unforgiveable sin is not a single act, but the collective acts of a person's life, which only God knows completely. Therefore, he alone can judge someone as being guilty of this sin. Anyone who shuns another for anything short of the unforgiveable sin is committing a grave error and severely misinterpreting the totality of what the Bible says about the practice. This is the highest form of arrogance, to assume a characteristic only God has and ascribe it to yourself. Shunning others for sins they have committed is not only impractical, but, much worse, it is evil and the epitome of arrogance.
When I left, I was convicted by the "court" of unrepentant trespass against the Sabbath commandment. This is the justification some have had for shunning me. I hadn't been attending church regularly at all, much less twice a Sunday. This, however, is a moot point; Christ fulfilled the law as given to the Jews of the Old Testament. None of those restrictions about keeping the Sabbath Day holy apply to us as they did to the Jews. The whole "church 2x each Sunday or you're sinning" rule is a law made of men, not by God. The PRs are right in that you should desire to be a member of the church, but church is a lot more broad than what they think it is. To separate yourself from the PRC is not the same as to separate yourself from the church or from God. Anyone who acknowledges this (and actually applies this belief to others in their lives) has an idea of what true Christianity is about; anyone who does not accept this truth and apply it has a cultish way of thinking, which is evil, and you should distance yourself from such people for the sake of your spiritual well-being (this is not the same as cutting them off, mind you, if you make sure to never write them off as a lost cause to God).
My sin was refusing to be bound the Pharasitical (that's a word, right?), loveless, merciless legalism of the PRC. And this extended beyond the Sabbath commandment. Despite losing many people whom I loved and who I thought had loved me, I would make that same decision every time. If someone, whether family member or friend, only "loves" you because of the type of church you attend, they are not worth having around.
To many here, I may be beating a long-dead horse, but I think what I have mentioned above could really help those who are worried about being shunned if they leave and also those who have been hurt by shunning they have experienced for leaving the PRC.
Just my thoughts at midnight CT.
The Bible does, in fact, mention shunning as an appropriate action towards those guilty of certain sins, such as greed, sexual immorality, idolatry, and a few others (I Cor. 5:11). Every human who has ever lived (even those in the PRC) has been guilty of at least one of these sins at one time or another.
Do we know for sure all the sins others in our lives have been / are guilty of? Not always; most of the time, no.
Does the fact that we committed these sins mean we are destined for eternal hellfire? Yes, but Jesus died for the sins of a select few.
Do we know exactly who is part of this select few? No; and even if we are supposed to see this "by their fruits", this is still not enough evidence for us imperfect humans to make a judgment on another's eternal destination, since we never know all the fruits a person bears in their life. A person is judged by God on the complete life they've lived; did the Holy Spirit cause them to repent? We can never know for sure, since we are not all-knowing. None of us know absolutely everything about even our own lives, much less the lives of others. Only God does, so only he can judge.
The only people who are deserving of shunning are those who have committed the unforgiveable sin, part of which is unrepentance. People may live in certain vile sins without remorse for many years, but we may never know if they will eventually turn from these sins, so we should treat them with grace, as Jesus, who was always ministering to those considered to be the vile ones of society, did, while also protecting our own spiritual well-being and that of those for whom we are responsible, such as our children. I emphasize that this does not mean cutting off someone absolutely. There must always be room for grace; to deny this is to deny the power of the Holy Spirit, and part of the unforgiveable sin. To treat them as dead when they may be very much alive, so to speak, is a serious mistake, and is in disobedience to the greatest commandment of all, which is to love others. Some of us may know what I Cor. 13 says, which is that without this love for others, we are nothing, regardless of what else we do or what others may think of us.
I guess to summarize, the unforgiveable sin is not a single act, but the collective acts of a person's life, which only God knows completely. Therefore, he alone can judge someone as being guilty of this sin. Anyone who shuns another for anything short of the unforgiveable sin is committing a grave error and severely misinterpreting the totality of what the Bible says about the practice. This is the highest form of arrogance, to assume a characteristic only God has and ascribe it to yourself. Shunning others for sins they have committed is not only impractical, but, much worse, it is evil and the epitome of arrogance.
When I left, I was convicted by the "court" of unrepentant trespass against the Sabbath commandment. This is the justification some have had for shunning me. I hadn't been attending church regularly at all, much less twice a Sunday. This, however, is a moot point; Christ fulfilled the law as given to the Jews of the Old Testament. None of those restrictions about keeping the Sabbath Day holy apply to us as they did to the Jews. The whole "church 2x each Sunday or you're sinning" rule is a law made of men, not by God. The PRs are right in that you should desire to be a member of the church, but church is a lot more broad than what they think it is. To separate yourself from the PRC is not the same as to separate yourself from the church or from God. Anyone who acknowledges this (and actually applies this belief to others in their lives) has an idea of what true Christianity is about; anyone who does not accept this truth and apply it has a cultish way of thinking, which is evil, and you should distance yourself from such people for the sake of your spiritual well-being (this is not the same as cutting them off, mind you, if you make sure to never write them off as a lost cause to God).
My sin was refusing to be bound the Pharasitical (that's a word, right?), loveless, merciless legalism of the PRC. And this extended beyond the Sabbath commandment. Despite losing many people whom I loved and who I thought had loved me, I would make that same decision every time. If someone, whether family member or friend, only "loves" you because of the type of church you attend, they are not worth having around.
To many here, I may be beating a long-dead horse, but I think what I have mentioned above could really help those who are worried about being shunned if they leave and also those who have been hurt by shunning they have experienced for leaving the PRC.
Just my thoughts at midnight CT.
